penguinfaery | (no subject)

So this is the outline for my panel I just submitted for NDK, and hence is the outline for my panel at Otakon. If you have an opinion at all about Het, Yuri, or yaoi, you should read it and see if you have anything to add that I've forgotten.

This panel usually is much more of a lead discussion then a presentation, so I tend to keep the outline rough and flexible. Generally as soon as discussion is open it's just a matter of guiding it along and moderating it.

INTRODUCTION
-introduction of myself

-an explanation of terms for the panel; Shipping (pairing two or more couples, comes from relationship), OTP (One true pairing, or a favorite couple), IC (In character), OOC (Out of character) GLBT (Gay, Lesbian, Bi, Transgender), etc.

-Warning: This is a panel about respect, but it is also not a safe zone, and adult concepts will be talked about freely. Also this panel is not about how hawt two guys making out is, although that will possibly be discussed to.

HET COUPLES
-What do you look for in hetero couple? What do you dislike?

-Strong females or not: Cultural difference between eastern and western concepts of woman and relationships.

-Females as companions to males vs females as character in their own right.

-The heteronormative nature of our society.

-Canon couples versus fanon couples.

-If fangirls can make straight guys gay for their couples, why can't they make gay guys straight? Can they?

YURI
-Why is there such a lack of quality yuri in fandom?

-Yuri as fanservice for men as oppose to yuri as interesting, dynamic couples? Where is the line? Is there one?

-Yuri as porn compared to yuri as plot.

-Canon yuri versus fanon yuri

-The difference between western and eastern female ideals in reference to yuri

-A good amount of yaoi fangirls are lesbian or bisexual, yet yuri is overwhelmingly the least popular of these three genres. Why?

YAOI
-Yaoi compared to real life homosexuality

-The heteronormative nature of society in reference to anime and manga-if 10% of the population is gay, where are all the gay characters? If a character's preference is not shown, why is it assumed they are staright?

-Homosexuality in Japan

-Homosexuality in fantasy worlds (How would Konoha feel about gay kids?)

-Bi-sexuality exists, and the Kinsey scale rules. If a married man flirt with a guy, it doesn't make him 100% gay, and if a man flirt with a girl it doesn't make him 100% straight.

-Twisting characterization for the gay. Why you don't need to alter a characters personality to force them into a couple.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

-Homosexuality in Japan

-Homosexuality in fantasy worlds (How would Konoha feel about gay kids?)

-Bi-sexuality exists, and the Kinsey scale rules. If a married man flirt with a guy, it doesn't make him 100% gay, and if a man flirt with a girl it doesn't make him 100% straight.

-Twisting characterization for the gay. Why you don't need to alter a characters personality to force them into a couple.

I feel like these four are...more general ones for like a yaoi/yuri combined? if you understand. They kinda floaty dance around that line inbetween them. (but I...understand why you put them in Yaoi...since it comes up more I think *hasn't explored fem-slash as much in that regard*) I know you can't really be like NOW FOR THE INBETWEEN QUESTIONS, but...maybe some more yaoi specific questions? I'm sure it'll be fine if you don't come up with something else though. Just food for thought \o/

annnnd if this comment doesn't make any sense just ignore it jfkldsa /edits this comment a thousand times

Edited 2010-07-12 07:33 (UTC)

Unfortunately, Yuri really comes down to "Why is it all fanservice for men and girls don't seem to like it as much." There aren't as many subtle nuances to explore cause....very few people give a shit.

In other words, you should be 100% right, but there's just not as much to talk about in yuri. I'll go there if I can generate interest in it, but....there just isn't as much :

I've actually read a good number of GL mango that are focused on plot as opposed to delicious lesbians. (Admittedly, I have had more luck finding BL focused on plot, though.)

I like these questions, especially the ones about yuri, since I seem to be the exception. I only read yaoi because I can't find good yuri, and it's at least better than reading a straight couple, at least in my brain. If there were yuri written for women, both novels and manga, not so much for the necessity of porn, but dictating real-life stories with love involved, I'd be flying to the Moon with happiness. Of course my favorite couple is Yamato and Koya from Loveless *hand over heart* <3

Not sure if this is what you meant, but I do know that almost all of the authors there are women. And the two books I've read were quite tasteful with a number of others looking rather interesting. No manga though, just novels.

http://www.boldstrokesbooks.com/

\o/ Thanks so much for this!! <3

even in fan fiction yuri tends to be very pwp based and there isn't too much plot to anything. When it comes down to it I'd read yuri if there was something good out there. I have tried but they are few and far between and that saddens me greatly. I think part of it is the fact that even in real life two women together are still very fetishized at least in america ("I support gay marriage so long as the two chick are hot!" shirts") where as gay men are taboo. Even in Yaoi there is little dynamic away from heteronormative relationships. Most times theres still the "top" and "bottom" (man/woman) there isn't alot of sway away from a male/female relationship besides the fact that they both have cocks now.

I need to find that lesbian comic I used to read with the two girls, ones and artist and ones a fashion designer and it was pretty awesome (though one of the girls was bi in all actuality)

I like the fact that LGBT is mentioned and this is a talk more based on how it ties into society.

This panel sounds very interesting. Otakon's... this weekend, right? I can't think of anything in particular you could add, just that you should still watch out for fangirls/boys who really are there just to talk about how hot their OTP's are. Even with the warning, people might not care or not believe you, and people always walk in late to panels.

Break a leg.

I WANT TO GO TO THIS PANEL, I love discussing things like this.